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Imbalance ... the Nano-Inertial Battleships

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 6 post(s)
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 05:45:00 - [1] Edited by: Rachel Vend on 23/01/2007 05:41:31 Solution to nanos.
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 19:37:00 - [2] You want to know what it's really about? When people find a setup that the pvp'er's can't beat or have a hard time beating because they have to use their heads, the pvp'ers flood the forums with whines that this setup is too powerful. Look what happened with scan probes, it was the other way around, the carebears whined and whined about getting ganked in low sec in deadspace missions while the pvp'ers just said "tough luck" all of the time. The pvp'ers are now whining that they arent killing 50 people a day, but only 25 people a day. What an outrage! Give us a counter to the bubblecamps which do not include: 1. Trial account alt scout, or alt scout at all. 2. Instantly logging. 3. 500 people in gang with you to crash the system. Nanoships are the ONLY counter to bubble camps, I guess it's not fun losing victims huh. In EVE, there is no pvp. It's PVPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 20:13:00 - [3] Originally by: Montaire The take home today : Its okay for ships to be able to run blockades, move ludicrously fast and zip around the battlefield. Its not okay for those ships to be battleships. So then it's okay as long as you can kill them with one shot anyway?
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 20:26:00 - [4] Edited by: Rachel Vend on 23/01/2007 20:23:16 Originally by: Montaire No, thats not what I said. And if you have a "Kill Vagabond in 1 shot" setup your my new hero. The idea of balance is that you trade advantages and disadvantages. Vagabonds cant use large guns or 5 heavy drones. Interceptors cant use medium or large guns, and can barely field a few light drones, forget about larges. The nanoships are unbalanced because they are BETTER than an interceptor. They are BETTER than a Vagabond (Also I think Eagle and Muninn are in this "Fast Attack HAC" class) They also lack any effective counter. This is the very definition of "unbalanced" and it DOES need fixing. Whats the effective counter to bubble camps? Remember kids: 1. No 100 man gangs 2. No alt scuts 2. No logging 4. Your in a BS.
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 20:29:00 - [5] Originally by: Ryysa Originally by: Rachel Vend Originally by: Montaire No, thats not what I said. And if you have a "Kill Vagabond in 1 shot" setup your my new hero. The idea of balance is that you trade advantages and disadvantages. Vagabonds cant use large guns or 5 heavy drones. Interceptors cant use medium or large guns, and can barely field a few light drones, forget about larges. The nanoships are unbalanced because they are BETTER than an interceptor. They are BETTER than a Vagabond (Also I think Eagle and Muninn are in this "Fast Attack HAC" class) They also lack any effective counter. This is the very definition of "unbalanced" and it DOES need fixing. Whats the effective counter to bubble camps? BBB(tm) - Bring Bigger Blob or Vagabond+Inty gang. So then if your SOLO, you should die 100% of the time when you jump into a bubble camp. That's nice.
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 20:42:00 - [6] Originally by: Aramendel Originally by: Rachel Vend Whats the effective counter to bubble camps? Remember kids: 1. No 100 man gangs 2. No alt scouts 2. No logging 4. Your in a BS. Blobs suck, but you do not make a right with 2 wrongs. One might as well ask: Whats the effective counter to nanoships? Remember kids: 1. No gangs 2. No med guns 2. Not more nosses 4. You are in a BS A nanoship which is faster than his nanoship, and bring some webs.
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 21:10:00 - [7] Originally by: Wizzkidy Originally by: Kristie It only takes 1 Huginn to ruin a nano BS's day...nope they are not that powerful. The only ships I ever see nanoBS kill are ships with a **** poor tank or ships who are not intending to pvp. I'll keep my double large armor reps thank you ^_^ Wrong 1 huginn will NOT, I repeat NOT stop a nanoBS from escaping. This tactic DOES NOT WORK (most of the time)the inersia the BS gets from the MWD means it will get away. OH NO IT WILL GET AWAY AND CAUSE YOU ABSOLUTELY NO LOSSES OMG OMG HOW HORRIBLE!!!!
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 21:13:00 - [8] Originally by: Andreya Ok, i have read enough of these posts. maybe these istabs are makin gyour battleships and battlecruisers fun to fly, myself being a inty/dictor pilot, has definately not made the game more fun to me.. dealing with heavy nos is one thing, but when the damn ships are going just as fast or FASTER than and everyday inty, it makes it pretty lame for us poeple who specc'd in small ships Make the inties faster then.
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 21:16:00 - [9] Originally by: Tovarishch The people saying 'Adapt or Die' are criminally out of touch with reality and apparently do not have enough sense to logically look at the issue here. The person who actually suggested that there is no problem with nano-setups because anyone can use the same setup against them is sadly lacking the ability to see the laughable reasoning (or lack thereof) with that argument. A very simple indicator for when something is out of balance in a game is when you find a ship/setup/module/etc becoming such an incredibly popular choice that it becomes a trend at the exclusion of other alternatives. This particular issue crossed that line a while back. Inertial Stabs exacerbated the problem. Hmm... That's funny, coming from a Caldari player. Considering all NPC runners use RAVENS, how come your not trying to get RAVENS nerfed? EVERYBODY uses Ravens to NPC and do missions in. So that must mean RAVENS are overpowered!
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 21:29:00 - [10] Edited by: Rachel Vend on 23/01/2007 21:32:05 One point I am trying to make is the fact that if the nanoship wants to fight, it's not that hard to kill them when you get some webs on him. If a nanoship pilot is fitting NOS (which he will have to in order to maintain the MWD), he will need to be within 25k of his victim. If he's within 25k, several inties can get on him and web him, or a hugin or however you spell it could just web him to death. The problem isnt that though. The problem is them getting away from a fight, and the empty feeling you have inside knowing you just missed out on a flashing mail icon and a kill mail to post on your fancy killboard, I mean, after all everything that goes into a bubble camp should just automatically explode before they even see the solarsystem name. You know what, I have an idea that will make you guys happy. Change the bubbles so that when there is a bubble on the other side of the gate, the stargate shows "Stargate (Clone Vat Bay)", and if someone jumps thru, the campers just see a wreck and a corpse. The victim wakes up in a new clone.

Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 21:36:00 - [11] Originally by: F Apparition This is the ideal place to show off my s****y signature!
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 21:48:00 - [12] Originally by: Tovarishch The problem very much is the fact that it is hard to kill them. Explain to us why you are flying around a 4 bill isk ship that is EASY to kill, please. I would love too, first I'll say that I have been using this setup for a very long time now, back when WCS were king and everyone and their dog had instas. I never used instas. I never used WCS. I don't log off in a fight. Instead, I thought of another way, that was more "honorable" than using WCS, or using instas, or logging off in a fight. So, I spent a considerable amount of income on a very different setup. It worked, and it has it's downside. It takes 5 minutes to kill a rookie ship. It's purely travel. I still don't log off, I still dont use instas (dont have to now haha), and I still don't use WCS. I use this setup because quite frankly, I don't want to die to a 50 vs 1 fight. I don't want to be lame and log off in a fight, I'm trying to counter things using REAL game mechanics, not metagame 'exploits' like logging off to save your ship. You on the other hand, just want everything you see to die instantly without any chance whatsoever.
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 22:38:00 - [13] Originally by: Tovarishch Originally by: Rachel Vend It takes 5 minutes to kill a rookie ship. It's purely travel. Your penchant for wild exaggeration is making your posts look more ridiculous... and you're losing the little credibility you have left by saying such things. Wow, yes itÆs an exaggeration. But the fact remains, if you die to a nanoship, you have bigger problems. Their damage potential isnÆt that great and can be tanked. Originally by: Tovarishch Quote: Instead, I thought of another way, that was more "honorable" than using WCS, or using instas, or logging off in a fight. This statement provides solid proof of the idea that people are using these setups as a replacement for WCS... which were nerfed for a reason. Nano setups provide similar escape advantages as WCS... without the penalties. They were nerfed because of whiners were not getting as many targets as they wanted. Now the targets found a new way, and the whiners are back whining. What a glorious cycle! Originally by: Tovarishch Quote: I don't want to die to a 50 vs 1 fight. Any ship should die in a 50 v 1 fight. You making this statement again proves my point. Nano setups are VERY difficult to kill... and you are flying an expensive setup around because you understand that fact. Thanks. Maybe you should be on the receiving end of a 50 vs 1 fight a few times, oh right, youÆre the one of the 50 in the blob and you want a kill mail!
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.23 23:59:00 - [14] Originally by: Tovarishch WCS were nerfed because they long needed a nerf... long before you began playing this game. Your agenda is to continue to keep your favored setup powerful... an interest that obviously has nothing to do with game balance. You have stated in this thread that any single player should be able to escape any single gang or camp at any given time... which leads to the concept of 'You cannot kill me unless I want to be killed'. What you want is hand-held safety all the time. Please read my above post. OT: In case you havent noticed yet, this is an alt. You have been playing EVE for a less than a day longer than me. You CAN kill nanoships, you just have to THINK of a way to do it. Since your having a bit of difficulty, you assume it's overpowered. I had great difficulty thinking of a way to get out of bubble camps without using WCS or instas, or logging. So, obviously, you might have a bit of difficulty thinking of a counter to my setup. But once you do, if you can think of a counter, everyone and their dog will do it. Personally, rather than nerfing the nanos, I'd rather see them just come up with a slightly better counter, maybe a task for Tech 2 webs.
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.24 00:39:00 - [15] Originally by: Tovarishch You went on in your post to make my point for me. Intys do not pose the same threat as nano battleships. A nano BS that runs away is a threat?
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.24 00:54:00 - [16] Originally by: Warrio Countering Nano BS's: You will need; 1 high slot and 3 mid slots. You will also need; 1 Large Smart Bomb and 3 Sensor Damps You will also need IQ over 5. Smartbomb makes the drones say goodnight. Damps deal with missiles and nos's. The rest shouldn't be too hard to figure out. Fixed.
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.24 03:24:00 - [17] Originally by: HankMurphy If someone puts billions of isk into his implants and his ship setup, i dont wanna hear how you cant counter it w/ a 30million isk ceptor and a hundred million isk recon. Go invest what he invested, pwn his arse, and know you won a fair fight. NOOOO!! We can't do that! Then we are putting ISK at risk, we want to kill the guys with multi-billion ISK ships with ships worth 30 million ISK, because theres more profit in that and we don't want to risk our precious ISK on setups to counter their expensive setups!
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.24 07:44:00 - [18] Nerf Blobs!
Rachel Vend Gallente Zend Insurance	Posted - 2007.01.25 22:37:00 - [19] Originally by: Raven DeBlade speed shoul be ingame BUT at a penalty, it is rediculous to see all these hyperfast ships zip along and be able to do what they do without any significant risk. There are several penalties already: 1. Their damage is total crap. 2. If they get webbed, they are on the express train to the clone bay. 3. The better (faster) setups are just as expensive as the faction/officer tank setups, and just as hard to kill.

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